Kerb Weight and Plate Upgrade

[Saxo Appeal]

Hi folks,

Has everyone used TowCar.info for all required details if your car can pull a caravan ok?

We have a 2020 SQ5 Audi and on the V5 it states Max permissible 2625, and mass in Service is 2118

Is my Mass in Service the Kerb Weight?

And if we are offered a weight plate upgrade, should we take it, and what allowance is then given?

The caravan we will be pulling is Challenger Grande 670 SE / 2023

Car V5

Caravan Plate:

 

[RogerL]

Mass In Service is close to kerbweight but they're defined differently.

Taking a weight upgrade for the caravan is a double edged sword - yes, it usefully increases your payload but may make it harder to sell when the time comes as it's beyond the average tow car's ability.

 

[GaryB]

Mass in service ISN’T the same as kerb weight but pretty close. Weight plate upgrade or not, you’ve got a formidable tow car that should be a good tug for the caravan in question.

 

[Saxo Appeal]

Mass In Service is close to kerbweight but they're defined differently.

Taking a weight upgrade for the caravan is a double edged sword - yes, it usefully increases your payload but may make it harder to sell when the time comes as it's beyond the average tow car's ability.

Very good point, regarding the sell…. didnt think of that.

 

[Saxo Appeal]

Mass in service ISN’T the same as kerb weight but pretty close. Weight plate upgrade or not, you’ve got a formidable tow car that should be a good tug for the caravan in question.

Thanks Gary,

Just out of curiosity, if I didn‘t grade the plate, what allowance do I have for filling the caravan?

I am also having the Powrtouch AWD fitted by the dealer, which I think equals about 70KG for all the units combined.

 

[otherclive]

Mass In Service is close to kerbweight but they're defined differently.

Taking a weight upgrade for the caravan is a double edged sword - yes, it usefully increases your payload but may make it harder to sell when the time comes as it's beyond the average tow car's ability.

But any new owner does not have to load the caravan to its upgraded MTPLM so can still tow it with their tow car.

 

[Hutch]

I would go for the upgrade to the MTPLM,as Clive states you don't have to use it. Anyone towing a caravan, that size will have a heafty car anyway. And any extra payload is worth it.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hi folks,

Has everyone used TowCar.info for all required details if your car can pull a caravan?

Not every one uses that specific site or others. I don't because there have been instances where the date the sites use is inaccurate, and thus their suggestions would also be inaccurate.

I suspect from various points in your previous comments that your not in the UK., and therefore our answers which are based on UK regulations and advice may not be appropriate or even legal where you are. Some models of car may have different limits to those in the UK becasue of local regulations.

You need to check and follow the definitions and towing regulations for the country where you are.

We have a 2020 SQ5 Audi and on the V5 it states Max permissible 2625, and mass in Service is 2118

Is my Mass in Service the Kerb Weight?

And if we are offered a weight plate upgrade, should we take it, and what allowance is then given?

Mass in service in the EU is defined differently to Kerbweight, and are not the same thing

There is no "weight plate upgrade" for tow vehicles, that is set in stone by the vehicle manufacturer

And if we are offered a weight plate upgrade, should we take it, and what allowance is then given?

The caravan we will be pulling is Challenger Grande 670 SE / 2023

In the UK we have an Trade organisation called the "National Caravan Council" (NCC) and the UK industry has agreed to follow a set of weight related guidelines that set the MTPLM of caravans built and sold in the UK. The effect of these guidelines is to set an artificially lower MTPLM for some caravans, and where the MTPLM is lower than the official (EU) weight limits, the UK manufacturers may (but not always) offer a weight plate upgrade,

This same practice may not be available or allowed in other countries, due to local regulations, and in fact the NCC's limit may not be even recognised outside of the UK as the NCC plate does not conform to EU regulations. UK caravan should have an EU compliant data plate with the the Axle loads near the front of the caravan.

If you have or are about to purchase a UK built caravan, please make sure you get the Certificate of Conformance from the manufacturer, which is required in many other countries to allow you to register or insure the caravan.

 

[Saxo Appeal]

I do live in the UK, Scotland

 

[Buckman]

What is the maximum MTPLM of the caravan?

 

[Saxo Appeal]

What is the maximum MTPLM of the caravan?

Picture of the caravan plate in 1st post mate

1863kg

 

[GaryB]

At the minute you have a 180kg allowance (the difference between the two weights on the plate) BUT that assumes that your caravan actually weighs the same as the unladen weight, manufacturing tolerances etc can add a bit meaning that the payload allowance is actually less. Although 180kgs sounds a lot, all of your bits & pieces soon eat it away.

I always go for a weight upgrade, our previous caravan went from 1624kgs to 1800kgs MTPLM, (1426kgs MIRO) giving a massive payload of 374kgs!!!!!! Our current caravan went from 1468kgs to 1500kgs, have a look in the gas locker, there’s an engraved plate in there which will show a weight which is the maximum weight it can be plated to.

 

[Saxo Appeal]

We also have AWD Powrtouch motor movers going to be fitted, on their website it states they weight 70kg (estimate)

I think the best idea is to buy the weight upgrade plate, what with having the movers fitted it's reducing the allowance by 70kg already.

 

[GaryB]

We also have AWD Powrtouch motor movers going to be fitted, on their website it states they weight 70kg (estimate)

I think the best idea is to buy the weight upgrade plate, what with having the movers fitted it's reducing the allowance by 70kg already.

Definitely go for it. It won’t make any difference to the resale value, it has never been questioned when we have changed caravans. As others said, people don’t have to use all the allowance if they don’t want to.

 

[Saxo Appeal]

Definitely go for it. It won’t make any difference to the resale value, it has never been questioned when we have changed caravans. As others said, people don’t have to use all the allowance if they don’t want to.

Just out of curiosity, how did you get 180kg? I'm doing something wrong

 

[GaryB]

Take the maximum laden weight 1863 away from the empty weight 1683 to give your allowance of 180kgs

 

[Saxo Appeal]

Ok I see now,

So taking away the 70kg for the motor movers leaves 110....

Yep, definetly going for the plate upgrade.

 

[Saxo Appeal]

At the minute you have a 180kg allowance (the difference between the two weights on the plate) BUT that assumes that your caravan actually weighs the same as the unladen weight, manufacturing tolerances etc can add a bit meaning that the payload allowance is actually less. Although 180kgs sounds a lot, all of your bits & pieces soon eat it away.

I always go for a weight upgrade, our previous caravan went from 1624kgs to 1800kgs MTPLM, (1426kgs MIRO) giving a massive payload of 374kgs!!!!!! Our current caravan went from 1468kgs to 1500kgs, have a look in the gas locker, there’s an engraved plate in there which will show a weight which is the maximum weight it can be plated to.

Isn't there some sort of caluclation, regarding a percentage that you shouldn't go above when pulling a caravan?

Would the upgrade plate not push this too far for my car?

 

[otherclive]

Hi folks,

Has everyone used TowCar.info for all required details if your car can pull a caravan ok?

We have a 2020 SQ5 Audi and on the V5 it states Max permissible 2625, and mass in Service is 2118

Is my Mass in Service the Kerb Weight?

And if we are offered a weight plate upgrade, should we take it, and what allowance is then given?

The caravan we will be pulling is Challenger Grande 670 SE / 2023

Car V5
View attachment 5383
Caravan Plate:

View attachment 5384

I’ve used Towcar.info on three outfits and found its predictions very good. It gives quite a good flexibility to vary and parameters such as noseweight, payload in car or van and transfer between the two. But as said above you need to ensure your data in is good.

 

[GaryB]

Ok, you’re thinking of the oft-quoted “85%” figure, this is a UK guideline of caravan MTPLM against the car empty weight. No-one know where this figure actually stems from and even with your upgraded plate, the empty weight of your car will still be in excess of the caravan’s upgraded MTPLM assuming it’ll be 1900kgs-ish.

 

[otherclive]

We also have AWD Powrtouch motor movers going to be fitted, on their website it states they weight 70kg (estimate)

I think the best idea is to buy the weight upgrade plate, what with having the movers fitted it's reducing the allowance by 70kg already.

Check with the dealer, manufacturer or Owners Manual what is included in MRO. Some large vans include for two gas cylinders and other variations compared to lighter vans. That way you know your payload starting point. Going for the weight upgrade is a no brainier as with 70 kg movers the remaining 110 kg will disappear like water down a drain. You don’t have to use all of the upgrade but it’s there if required.

 

[Buckman]

Picture of the caravan plate in 1st post mate

1863kg

Yes but you mentioned upgrading the caravan to its maximum MTPLM so was unsure, but checking the specs you have upgraded by 40kg which is better than nothing.

I am quite surprised that your tyre pressure is so low at 33psi as thougt it would be higher? MTPLM of our caravan is 2000kg and tyre pressure is 49psi.

 

[GaryB]

I am quite surprised that your tyre pressure is so low at 33psi as thougt it would be higher? MTPLM of our caravan is 2000kg and tyre pressure is 49psi.

Ours was similar on a 2018 Sprite Quattro EB twin axle. Ours was upgraded to 1800kgs and from memory the pressures increased to 35psi.

 

[Saxo Appeal]

Yes but you mentioned upgrading the caravan to its maximum MTPLM. Our MTPLM was plated at 1925kg, but we were able to upgrade to 2000kgs. Not sure if you can upgrade beyond what is stated on that plate?

I am quite surprised that your tyre pressure is so low at 33psi as thougt it would be higher? MTPLM of our caravan is 2000kg and tyre pressure is 49psi.

I have emailed the delaer and asked what our new weights will be after an upgrade.

 

[Buckman]

I have emailed the delaer and asked what our new weights will be after an upgrade.

It seems that that is the upgrade as original MTPLM is 1820kg.