This demonstrates why campsites want to meter electricity

[Mr Plodd]

Currently sat on Baltic Wharf CMC site. We arrived yesterday at about 14:30, so been pitched about 23 hours. My caravan is a 2019 Bailey, so we'll insulated.

I have the water heating on electric, but its just for washing as we use the sites showers and washing up facilities. The heating has been one since arrival. Daytime set at 19⁰ and night time at 13⁰ (can't have a hot bedroom) and we ate out at the pub next door last night. In addition I dropped the stat down to 14⁰ whilst we went off for a 3 hour walk earlier. Fridge was pre-cooled before leaving home.



On arrival I reset my power meter as I wanted to see what my electrical consumption was.



I have just checked and since arrival I have used 23 Kwh

Which quite frankly has horrified me! We have solar panels and battery storage at home so home electric consumption is minimal. Probably 25Kwh per WEEK



So assuming that electricity is around 28p per Kwh My 24 hours of consumption will have cost in the region of £6.50

The pitch fee is £36 per night, so, if lucky, the CMC will have made just under £30



So this experience clearly shows exactly why campsites are wanting to meter customers electricity usage doesn't it? and provides some justification as to why some charge £5-£6 per night for hook up.



I wonder how many days usage, under the same conditions, I could get out of a 6/7kg Calor.

Please DONT bother to try and convince me I need a Safefill or similar,

 

[otherclive]

When people say modern caravans are well insulated it puzzles me. Yes they are far better than yesteryear but when compared to a well insulated house caravans are well behind. Our last two were cosy and comfortable throughout but once the heating went off down came the temperature. Your detailed usage above was quite restrained compared to many who use site electricity. So I’d venture £5-6 per 24 hours could be on the low side for many who pitch up and use EHU.

 

[Mr Plodd]

When people say modern caravans are well insulated it puzzles me. Yes they are far better than yesteryear but when compared to a well insulated house caravans are well behind. Our last two were cosy and comfortable throughout but once the heating went off down came the temperature. Your detailed usage above was quite restrained compared to many who use site electricity. So I’d venture £5-6 per 24 hours could be on the low side for many who pitch up and use EHU.

You are probably correct, I just thought I would post my experience as I am sure the vast majority who use EHU never give a thought to how much they actually use per day.

I was, to say the least, more than a little shocked as I thought we were low users.
Lesson learnt.

 

[Beardy]

It's pretty cold at the moment, it dropped below freezing here last night so I guess that your heating was working much harder than on an average uk day. Last year in September we were using 7kw per day with the heating on for an hour in the morning and an hour in the evening plus hot water for washing, washing-up and one shower (Mrs Beardy prefers to use the caravan shower, I prefer site facilities).

23kW doesn't surprise me, you could add on another 1-2 kW for showers and water to wash up (unless the site charges for showers it's coming out of your pitch fee).

Swings and roundabouts though, usage would be much lower in the summer but I bet they charge the same.

 

[Paullus1959]

On arrival I reset my power meter as I wanted to see what my electrical consumption was.

Is this something your caravan has fitted or is it an accessory you've bought?
If it's an accessory can you give some more details please as I'd be interested in buying one?
Thanks

 

[Mr Plodd]

It's an extra I added myself. Purchased from Amazon
Not a difficult job if you are half handy/confident but it does involvecworking on the caravans 230v system,
It needs a 230v supply (so position near an 230v socket and take a feed off the back)

The orange coil goes around the + feed into the caravan (I just went to the back of the PSU, disconnected the + lead, passed it through the ring/coil and reconnected).

I had to extend the sensor wires about 3m, but speaker wire is more than adequate as it takes minimal current.

The backlight can be turned off (it's surprisingly bright at night)

 

[Mr Plodd]

Here is mine installed

 

[JTQ]

Sobering but not that surprising figures other than your very modest and I suspect restrained 19 C, if that includes much evening lounging post your meal.

As has been said, caravans are in relative terms not that well insulated, and the very confined space also means some ventilation is needed to control condensation, so space heating is going to be demanding in a cold ambient.

Thankfully, I believe it is the space heating element that really loads our energy usage amount, reflecting the outside temperature and chilling, so our use drops significantly as the outside warms up.
That is very noticeable for caravanners like us who typically use gas. We consequentially retire under the bedding even earlier than at home in cold times.

Returning to the subject of EHU metering, yes, I am a big believer in the concept, we pay amounts reflecting what "we" use. This, particularly as we have the legal protection deterring any would-be unscrupulous site owner.
Vans should have their own inbuilt meters so widely differing claims can be contested, and it would be no bad idea if the charge rate was an on site displayed price, as other things can be awning, showers etc.

 

[Mr Plodd]

.
Vans should have their own inbuilt meters so widely differing claims can be contested,

That was pretty much my reasoning behind fitting one!

Particularly as we travel abroad a fair bit and I wanted to be in a position to challenge any "dubious" figures.

Having said that the last 24 hours has proved a bit of an eye-opener!

 

[RogerL]

That was pretty much my reasoning behind fitting one!

Particularly as we travel abroad a fair bit and I wanted to be in a position to challenge any "dubious" figures.

Having said that the last 24 hours has proved a bit of an eye-opener!

Your figures are about what I'd expect in winter - in summer we use about 10 kwh / day with no heating on, based on the pitch meter where we stayed.

 

[Dustydog]

This last 12 months I have used two sites with payg electricity. North Yorkshire in the winter , 16 amp EHU, was costing us near enough £5 per 24 hours . No way did we burn 3.68 kWh per hour so I’d say for you that’s quite acceptable and no where near the maximum you could burn. The last site we were on stated the kWh cost was identical to their own cost. Not sure what rate CAMC use?

 

[Gafferbill]

.....we've always only used electricity when on EHU
and we never use any gas at all.
We also do everything in the caravan dish washing, clothes washing, personal washing and showering.
Occasionally we use site showers if they are clean and respectable.
Obviously we are using the sites electricity in the caravan not the amenity block.
Having to rethink how we do things now on metered sites since amenity block energy usage is largely not charged (showers maybe).

....if we carry on as we have been we are paying the site extra for the metered electricity and saving the site money by not using that energy in the amenity block!

 

[Beardy]

This last 12 months I have used two sites with payg electricity. North Yorkshire in the winter , 16 amp EHU, was costing us near enough £5 per 24 hours . No way did we burn 3.68 kWh per hour so I’d say for you that’s quite acceptable and no where near the maximum you could burn. The last site we were on stated the kWh cost was identical to their own cost. Not sure what rate CAMC use?

I believe that it has to be the same as their own cost by law, you can't buy electric at 29p per kWh and sell it for 30p per kWh unless you are licenced to do so. They can however charge you for use of their equipment (the socket you plug into).

I think that this was discussed before on here. The current energy price cap only applies to domestic properties, so the site you stay on may be on a business tariff which could be higher or lower.

 

[Woodentop]

Currently sat on Baltic Wharf CMC site. We arrived yesterday at about 14:30, so been pitched about 23 hours. My caravan is a 2019 Bailey, so we'll insulated.

I have the water heating on electric, but its just for washing as we use the sites showers and washing up facilities. The heating has been one since arrival. Daytime set at 19⁰ and night time at 13⁰ (can't have a hot bedroom) and we ate out at the pub next door last night. In addition I dropped the stat down to 14⁰ whilst we went off for a 3 hour walk earlier. Fridge was pre-cooled before leaving home.



On arrival I reset my power meter as I wanted to see what my electrical consumption was.



I have just checked and since arrival I have used 23 Kwh

Which quite frankly has horrified me! We have solar panels and battery storage at home so home electric consumption is minimal. Probably 25Kwh per WEEK



So assuming that electricity is around 28p per Kwh My 24 hours of consumption will have cost in the region of £6.50

The pitch fee is £36 per night, so, if lucky, the CMC will have made just under £30



So this experience clearly shows exactly why campsites are wanting to meter customers electricity usage doesn't it? and provides some justification as to why some charge £5-£6 per night for hook up.



I wonder how many days usage, under the same conditions, I could get out of a 6/7kg Calor.

Please DONT bother to try and convince me I need a Safefill or similar,

I thought Baltic Wharf was closed or is about to close - or have the local council changed their minds yet again?

 

[Mr Plodd]

I thought Baltic Wharf was closed or is about to close - or have the local council changed their minds yet again?

Do pay attention at the back!
The lease has been extended (yet again) This time until mid December 24.

 

[Jcloughie]

Do pay attention at the back!
The lease has been extended (yet again) This time until mid December 24.

I need to buy another caravan! We could never get in there in the pasy.


John

 

[ProfJohnL]

Plod,
I had a similar meter, for a project where I needed to log an appliances consumption fairly accurately. As part of the set up procedure we needed to verify the meters accuracy. To my dismay I discovered the voltage reading was inconsistent compared to a calibrated Fluke 87, and what was worse the reading wandered around by up to 10% of the Flukes indication. We returned the unit as it was not suitable for purpose.

We did not check the current or the timing accuracy but if they were as variable as the voltage you could get a 30% error in logged consumption.

You might want to check your own module for accuracy.

 

[Mr Plodd]

I am not interested in a scientifically 100% accurate reading as I don't neerd it.

My meter almost certainly isn't as accurate as a hyper-expensive scientific one, but it gives me a pretty decent indication. Certainly the voltage reading appears about right, as does the amperage. So if two out of three are about right its probably that the third isn't too far off accurate
So I am happy to consider it reasonably accurate, the same as I considee my cars speedo to be reasonably accurate (but knowing its not 100%)

 

[Buckman]

Most people caravan in the warmer weather when they use a lot less electric so it balances out hence no reason to have metered pitches. I am sure sites have more people camping during the warmer months than the cooler months.

To be honest I hardly think that a consumption reading during the winter months can be used as guideline for metering all pitches. One needs to take the annual consumption overall into consideration which is probably what most all year sites do to make a profit.

 

[JTQ]

Most people caravan in the warmer weather when they use a lot less electric so it balances out hence no reason to have metered pitches. I am sure sites have more people camping during the warmer months than the cooler months.

To be honest I hardly think that a consumption reading during the winter months can be used as guideline for metering all pitches. One needs to take the annual consumption overall into consideration which is probably what most all year sites do to make a profit.

It is certainly not IMO equitable from a summer users' point of view, to be funding their fellow winter camper's energy consumption.

It might well be less hassle for the site owner to make up their winter energy sales losses by recouping from the summer user, hence not monitor it to individual user level.
However, me, I am firmly of a view in our leisure related, thus our optional choice-based matters, we pay for what we take, not expect others to fund our hobby choices.

 

[Buckman]

Some CLs increase their price in the cooler months as they know they are not going to get a high turnover and also that the customer will be using more electric. There is no objection to this method and we would be happy to pay an extra £5 a day.

 

[RogerL]

It is certainly not IMO equitable from a summer users' point of view, to be funding their fellow winter camper's energy consumption.

It might well be less hassle for the site owner to make up their winter energy sales losses by recouping from the summer user, hence not monitor it to individual user level.
However, me, I am firmly of a view in our leisure related, thus our optional choice-based matters, we pay for what we take, not expect others to fund our hobby choices.

Supply & demand means that basic pitch prices rise in summer - at the same time electric costs drop as the weather warms - there is some merit in charging the same total price all year round - the alternative is seasonal pitch prices plus metered electric.

 

[Mr Plodd]

.
However, me, I am firmly of a view in our leisure related, thus our optional choice-based matters, we pay for what we take, not expect others to fund our hobby choices.

Spot on sir!!

It reminds me of a pals daughter, she has her own house but refuses to have a water meter installed. The reason being that she likes to shower twice a day, for around THIRTY minutes a time! I have no idea what her gas bill must be but, apparently according to her, if she has a water meter her bill for water will virtually double from what the current cost (based on rateable value) is!

It amazes me that (some) people seem to think that clean, safe, tap water should not be paid for on a "You pay for what you use" basis like gas or electricity, but available as an "All you can eat" fixed sum deal.

Anyway, back to campsite 'leccy, we should all pay for what we use when we use it. So that's more cost in the winter and less in the summer, just like being at home!

 

[Mr Plodd]

. There is no objection to this method and we would be happy to pay an extra £5 a day.

But judging from my experience, and subject of this thread, a fiver a night wouldn't really cover the additional cost. As detailed I don't think my actions are in the slightest but wasteful, and my thermostat is set pretty low compared to some who have theirs set in the mid 20's AND heat tgeur awnings without giving a thought to the cost.

Meters are the only sensible /logical option but of course there is a cost to have them installed, and that cost has to be passed on!

 

[otherclive]

Spot on sir!!

It reminds me of a pals daughter, she has her own house but refuses to have a water meter installed. The reason being that she likes to shower twice a day, for around THIRTY minutes a time! I have no idea what her gas bill must be but, apparently according to her, if she has a water meter her bill for water will virtually double from what the current cost (based on rateable value) is!

It amazes me that (some) people seem to think that clean, safe, tap water should not be paid for on a "You pay for what you use" basis like gas or electricity, but available as an "All you can eat" fixed sum deal.

Anyway, back to campsite 'leccy, we should all pay for what we use when we use it. So that's more cost in the winter and less in the summer, just like being at home!

My daughter had her mains inlet rerouted by Wessex Water due to a major leak. It serves her and the neighbours house. She then requested a meter but the surveyor reported that due to the pipework configuration it could not be fitted. So Wessex Water then gave her a tariff well below the non-meters rate. But she’s never been wasteful even without a meter.