Towing a Hymer 390 with a CRV - or not

[macandy]

Hi all…

Having taken the plunge and bought a caravan, a Hymer 390, rather surprised to find my CRV is not man enough to tow such a small caravan. For real? 1,200kgs? Even the Honda dealer was surprised when I told them the 'ideal tow car' they sold me can't tow the skin off a rice pudding, they thought it was rated at 1,500kg

So… can any of you experienced people help me out here with all this MIRO, payloads, MTPLM and stuff?

2003 CR-V auto 1,200kg and 60kg (this magically increased to 1,500kg and 100kg six months later - checked with the dealer, no difference in the suspension, same part numbers)
Any mods to the car? Bigger wheels off a newer CRV and spring assisters as I sometimes carry things like 300kg car engines in the boot.

MRO - 1050kg
Payload Hymer quote 150kg, 300kg and 450kg?!?!
MPTLM - 1,350kg
Max nose weight 100kg

So I suppose the question is.
Chuck everything into the car, keep the caravan light, keep the nose weight at 60kg and it will be good to go?

Any advise really appreciated, but I have a sneeking suspicion I'm going to be looking at a newer CRV that is officially rated at 1,500kg?

 

[WoodlandsCamper]

First things first - what does your CRV's registration document (V5C) say about the vehicle?

What is its Mass In Service?

What is its Max permissible mass?

What is its Technical permissible maximum towable mass of the trailer (unbraked)? Edit - should have said 'braked' not 'unbraked'

What does the car's handbook say for nose weight?

What is the car's gross train weight, given on a plate on the door pillar?

With the above figures we can then help you.

 

[macandy]

No V5 to hand, (at work), but the plate in the engine bay says 1,960kg and 3160kg, kerb weight IIRC 1,486kg. Nose weight in 60kg

 

[WoodlandsCamper]

No V5 to hand, (at work), but the plate in the engine bay says 1,960kg and 3160kg, kerb weight IIRC 1,486kg. Nose weight in 60kg

As I understand it the VIN plate gives the following:

Top to bottom: -
Max Gross Vehicle Weight
Max Gross Train Weight
Max Front Axle load
Max Rear Axle Load

so I'm not sure which figures you are quoting.

 

[macandy]

No V5 to hand, (at work), but the plate in the engine bay says 1,960kg and 3160kg, kerb weight IIRC 1,486kg. Nose weight in 60kg

As I understand it the VIN plate gives the following:

Top to bottom: -
Max Gross Vehicle Weight - 1960kg
Max Gross Train Weight - 3160kg
Max Front Axle load - 960kg
Max Rear Axle Load - 1020kg

so I'm not sure which figures you are quoting.

Hope this helps

 

[WoodlandsCamper]

The difference between the first two weights is generally the max permissable towed weight, which in this case is 1200kg (3160 less 1960), but you need to confirm with your V5 certificate. If this is your max towed weight then your car, unfortunately, cannot legally tow your van with an MTPLM of 1350 kg.

Edit - my first reply to you should have said 'braked' rather than 'unbraked'.

 

[macandy]

Many thanks, all makes sense now.
Still very annoyed that the dealer 'These make great tow cars' was completely oblivious that Honda derated the 2nd Gen CRV autos.

Ah well, time to change the car methinks.

 

[ProfJohnL]

The difference between the first two weights is generally the max permissable towed weight, which in this case is 1200kg (3160 less 1960), but you need to confirm with your V5 certificate. If this is your max towed weight then your car, unfortunately, cannot legally tow your van with an MTPLM of 1350 kg.......:

Hello Woodlands. Your statement is not correct. The difference between the GTW and the GVW cars towing limit represents the guaranteed weight the vehicle could tow. The MTPLM is not a weight but a weight limit a subtle but important difference. the car could legally tow any trailer provided its actual weight does not exceed the vehicles specification even if its MTPLM is greater.

Of course you also have to consider id the combined MAM might be a problem for your driving licence categories .

 

[macandy]

so as long as I ran the van over a weigh bridge and it was 1,200kg or less, I'd be OK?

Licence is not a problem, passed my test in 1976.

 

[WoodlandsCamper]

You haven't yet confirmed what is the max towed braked weight given on the car's V5 certificate.

 

[macandy]

There are no weights specified on my V5C, not a single one. All blank.

 

[WoodlandsCamper]

Ah well, time to change the car methinks.

Looks like you might be right.

 

[ProfJohnL]

so as long as I ran the van over a weigh bridge and it was 1,200kg or less, I'd be OK?

Licence is not a problem, passed my test in 1976.

Subject to the Max braked towed weigh that Woodlands is asking for your contention is basically correct. It would be unusual for the BTW to be less that the difference between GTW - GVW in your case 1200Kg' but you must check the documents.

 

[macandy]

Which has me in a bind, as these weights are not listed on my V5 , all I have is the plate in the engine bay...

Caravans are confusing stuff.

 

[WoodlandsCamper]

Does this link
help?

Choose your specific vehicle and click on 'more info'.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Such web sites cannot be used as definitive information. Use the data plate on the car which should have the Gross Vehicle weight and Gross Train Weight the difference being the allowable towed weight.,

To be honest, if the difference between the Grow Train weight and the Gross Vehicle Weight is 1200Kg then you should be legal to tow as long as the trailers actual weight does not exceed 1200Kg

And in fact you can add you nose weight to that so technically you can tow a trailer whose weight is 1200+nose weight Kg. as the nose weight is not towed it is carried by the car.

 

[macandy]

Well Honda are looking a bit sheepish, my towing limit is less than a Jazz which is clearly rather stupid for a big 4x4, so we are discussing a 'generous' trade in allowance for exactly the same car, a 2004 auto, but plated at 1500kg.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Well Honda are looking a bit sheepish, my towing limit is less than a Jazz .....

I have had a quick look at a data base (note my reservations above) and the biggest braked towed weight for a Jazz is 1000Kg where as your CRV is 1200Kg!

 

[colin-yorkshire]

Well Honda are looking a bit sheepish, my towing limit is less than a Jazz .....

I have had a quick look at a data base (note my reservations above) and the biggest braked towed weight for a Jazz is 1000Kg where as your CRV is 1200Kg!

well it could be worse a 3 litre V6 odyssey is only 720kg

 

[macandy]

Well Honda are looking a bit sheepish, my towing limit is less than a Jazz .....

I have had a quick look at a data base (note my reservations above) and the biggest braked towed weight for a Jazz is 1000Kg where as your CRV is 1200Kg!

Was just being a bit rhetorical. Having said that, towing 1000kg in a CVT Jazz would be a losing game. Had a CVT Honda, box is at the limit without anything hung off the back - killed one.

 

[ProfJohnL]

One of the more popular databases quotes the old Mk1 CRV 2.0 auto at 1,300kgs... :huh:

You can't trust data bases. They do contain errors or don't contain all models of all cars or caravans. The problem is you don't know which bits are right or wrong. The authorities and therefore you will always go by the vehicle registration documents or information specifically related to the Vehicles VIN number.

 

[RogerL]

One of the more popular databases quotes the old Mk1 CRV 2.0 auto at 1,300kgs... :huh:

You can't trust data bases. They do contain errors or don't contain all models of all cars or caravans. The problem is you don't know which bits are right or wrong. The authorities and therefore you will always go by the vehicle registration documents or information specifically related to the Vehicles VIN number.

And the DVLA database also contains errors - but that is what the Police and VOSA will rely on.

 

[macandy]

One of the more popular databases quotes the old Mk1 CRV 2.0 auto at 1,300kgs... :huh:

You can't trust data bases. They do contain errors or don't contain all models of all cars or caravans. The problem is you don't know which bits are right or wrong. The authorities and therefore you will always go by the vehicle registration documents or information specifically related to the Vehicles VIN number.

All good fun, isn't it? My plated weights are 30kg heavier than the figures the dealer got off the Towsure database for the sales paperwork.

Dealer was top though, gave the same advice as your good self, run the car and the caravan over a weighbridge and get the weights checked.