Water system problems.

[JanJan]

Hello
I hope you can help me. I have several problems with my caravan water system. It is a pressure system with the addition of an internal onboard water tank fitted by Glossop Caravans when I purchased it from new. The caravan is now 12 years old. it is an Elddis Odyssy 634.

When the pump is on the internal position at the control panel.

The water flows through the taps. However, when the tap is turned off the pressure switch still makes a clicking noise. Even when the adjusting screw is removed completely.
The orange light on the control panel remains on when it is in the middle (i.e. off). The clicking stops when the panel switch is in this position.

When the pump is on the external position and middle positionat the control panel

The internal tank fills but does not stop when full.

The water flows from the tap but not at the same flow rate as when on internal.


I have had a mobile caravan fitter out to service the caravan and look at the water system.
The following have been replaced:
- the pump in the internal tank
- the pressure switch
- the solenoid
- the top float in the internal tank

He changed one of two inline floats in the onboard water tank and now the tank does not stop filling up. The inline float does not appear to be working.

I hope someone can help.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello JanJan

Welcome to the forum.

Wow you have a number of issues going on there.

If this has all started since the caravan techie worked on the system, you should consider getting them out to put it right under their warranty they have to give under the Consumer Rights Act.

There's too much to be clear about all the problems, but one of the symptoms could be why the pressure switch may not be working.

If the pressure switch continues to click and cause the pump to pulse, it almost certainly suggests there is a leak somewhere which allows the pressure to drop and cause the pressure switch to run the pump to replenish the pressure....repatedly. If you cant find any weeping joints or leaky taps, then it could well be a non return valve which might be not closing properly and thus releasing the pressure. As this will be inside the pipe work you won't see it weeping.

The pressure switch should have a non return valve built into its input fitting. Some of these can be dismantled and cleaned, but if the seal ( an "o" ring) might be damaged and need replacing.

Get that sorted and the seen how that might affect the other issues.

 

[JanJan]

Hello JanJan

Welcome to the forum.

Wow you have a number of issues going on there.

If this has all started since the caravan techie worked on the system, you should consider getting them out to put it right under their warranty they have to give under the Consumer Rights Act.

There's too much to be clear about all the problems, but one of the symptoms could be why the pressure switch may not be working.

If the pressure switch continues to click and cause the pump to pulse, it almost certainly suggests there is a leak somewhere which allows the pressure to drop and cause the pressure switch to run the pump to replenish the pressure....repatedly. If you cant find any weeping joints or leaky taps, then it could well be a non return valve which might be not closing properly and thus releasing the pressure. As this will be inside the pipe work you won't see it weeping.

The pressure switch should have a non return valve built into its input fitting. Some of these can be dismantled and cleaned, but if the seal ( an "o" ring) might be damaged and need replacing.

Get that sorted and the seen how that might affect the other issues.

Hi thank you for the welcome and your quick reply.

issues with the water system have been ongoing. We seem to sort one problem then another happens.

The mobile fitter is new as our usual man has stopped working.

The onboard tank overflowing due to the top inline float not working is the latest problem. The float has been replaced but doesn’t appear to work. The bottom float still works. I wonder if the top one is wired wrong or upside down?? I cannot work out how two floats can work with the solenoid. But i am no expert - just trying to work out the logic.

We have been in contact with the mobile fitter and he suggested, like you, that it could be a non return valve. We ordered a part to discover that the valve was not inside the socket but an inline valve. We checked the inline valve by blowing into it and it appears to be working. It is interesting that you say the pressure switch has a one way valve. We will check that tomorrow.

The recent spate of problems started when we cleaned out the system.

I will let you know how we get on.
Thanks again.

 

[Dustydog]

You have a diy hybrid system which makes diagnosis on here very difficult.
Just for starters ignoring all the other issues please can you explain how you fill the onboard tank from the external source?

 

[JanJan]

Hello JanJan

Welcome to the forum.

Wow you have a number of issues going on there.

If this has all started since the caravan techie worked on the system, you should consider getting them out to put it right under their warranty they have to give under the Consumer Rights Act.

There's too much to be clear about all the problems, but one of the symptoms could be why the pressure switch may not be working.

If the pressure switch continues to click and cause the pump to pulse, it almost certainly suggests there is a leak somewhere which allows the pressure to drop and cause the pressure switch to run the pump to replenish the pressure....repatedly. If you cant find any weeping joints or leaky taps, then it could well be a non return valve which might be not closing properly and thus releasing the pressure. As this will be inside the pipe work you won't see it weeping.

The pressure switch should have a non return valve built into its input fitting. Some of these can be dismantled and cleaned, but if the seal ( an "o" ring) might be damaged and need replacing.

Get that sorted and the seen how that might affect the other issues.

You have a diy hybrid system which makes diagnosis on here very difficult.
Just for starters ignoring all the other issues please can you explain how you fill the onboard tank from the external source?

Hi
We fill the onboard water tank via a Whale Watermaster pump in an aqua roll. We put the pump into the water, plug the pump into the caravan socket and set the switch in the caravan to external.
Thank you for your response. I hope we can solve the issues.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Thanks for clarifying.

As Dusty has pointed out you have a system that been modified, and it really needs some one who can probe the various contacts to see whats if anything is controlling the the external pump. It should be the upper float should turn off the external pump, and the lower float should prevent the internal pump from running if the water level gets too low, but without testing it's impossible to know whether its been correctly wired or not.

As I mentioned previously, as it was repaired by the Techie, they should have tested it and left it functioning correctly. They need to return to sort it out, and it should be free of charge as they were the last ones to touch the system.

 

[Dustydog]

Thanks for the reply.
There‘s a similarity to my own system.
Can you run the water system using only the aquaroll and its own submersible pump? I suspect when switched to External water is fed direct from the aquaroll hence a lower flow than from the higher onboard tank.
The top float in the on board tank is either fitted or wired incorrectly. As the level drops , so does the the float which should then make the circuit. Swap the wires over.
On mine the pump does tun on for a few seconds once the tap is turned off, rebuilding the pressure.Normal.
Where the pipe from the aquaroll joins the caravan are two o rings. Clean the housing and replace the o rings.
Any photos of the switches and rest of the system?

I wrote this before I saw Prof’s last post

 

[JanJan]

Thanks for clarifying.

As Dusty has pointed out you have a system that been modified, and it really needs some one who can probe the various contacts to see whats if anything is controlling the the external pump. It should be the upper float should turn off the external pump, and the lower float should prevent the internal pump from running if the water level gets too low, but without testing it's impossible to know whether its been correctly wired or not.

As I mentioned previously, as it was repaired by the Techie, they should have tested it and left it functioning correctly. They need to return to sort it out, and it should be free of charge as they were the last ones to touch the system.

Hi. Thanks for you comments.

Yes the upper float doesn’t cut out. The lower one does. it sounds like you think this could be a wiring fault. I asked earlier if anyone could explain the logic of how the two floats work together. In my mind if they both work the same way they would be cancelling one another out??????

When the techie left it was working. Normally I would ask the techie to come back but we haven’t got time so we are trying to sort this out ourselves.

Thanks again. It is good to get feedback that clarifies our thoughts on the issues.

 

[JanJan]

Thanks for the reply.
There‘s a similarity to my own system.
Can you run the water system using only the aquaroll and its own submersible pump? I suspect when switched to External water is fed direct from the aquaroll hence a lower flow than from the higher onboard tank.
The top float in the on board tank is either fitted or wired incorrectly. As the level drops , so does the the float which should then make the circuit. Swap the wires over.
On mine the pump does tun on for a few seconds once the tap is turned off, rebuilding the pressure.Normal.
Where the pipe from the aquaroll joins the caravan are two o rings. Clean the housing and replace the o rings.
Any photos of the switches and rest of the system?

I wrote this before I saw Prof’s last post

Hi. Thanks again for helping.

We have to fill the onboard tank (and check it doesn‘t overflow). For some reason we cannot run bypassing the onboard tank.

We purchased parts for the socket and replaced the o rings. We were surprised to find there wasn’t a non return valve in the socket. We then realised there was a non return valve inline. We checked that and it works. There also appears to be another part missing with a white dial, but we think that is replaced by the inline pressure switch. I now realise there are different models.

I have attached further pictures. I can take more if needed.

We still have to check the pressure switch as suggested by Prof. We have plans to do that today.

Thanks again!!!!Very much appreciate!!

 

[JanJan]

Hi

We have checked the pressure switch, it is clean, the umbrella valve and the o ring are in tack. The pressure switch isn’t now continually clicking but the on board water tank pump doesn’t stop pumping when you turn the taps off.

The pump turns off if you press the bottom inline float down. It doesn’t respond to the top inline float so the tank overflows.

My guess is the fault is with the electrics????? We appear to have done everything on the water side???? Or is the system not getting up to pressure?????

😭😩

Any further suggestions would be much appeciated.

Thank you.

 

[Dustydog]

The more I hear the more a bloke Heath Robinson springs to mind!

Without seeing the installation, the interaction between the master control panel and exactly how the pumps and floats are wired and interconnected I have to say sorry but I could spend hours trying to map it all out from the posts you have sent.
All I can do from a distance is recommend you get the engineer back or talk to Glossop caravans.
Good luck

 

[JanJan]

The more I hear the more a bloke Heath Robinson springs to mind!

Without seeing the installation, the interaction between the master control panel and exactly how the pumps and floats are wired and interconnected I have to say sorry but I could spend hours trying to map it all out from the posts you have sent.
All I can do from a distance is recommend you get the engineer back or talk to Glossop caravans.
Good luck

😂 Heath Robinson.

Maybe I have made it sound more complicated than it is. When it works it works well. I cannot help thinking that it is something reasonably simple that we have overlooked.

We have made attempts to contact Glossop caravans. Two phone call messages left on their system to get callbacks. I spoke to them on Chat on their website and they said to fill in an online form; they have not responded. I have emailed them; they have not responded.

We have also sent an email to the mobile caravan fitter to explain the current situation and I am hoping he will call back soon. We have a holiday booked, hence the urgency to get it working.

Thanks.

 

[JanJan]

Thanks for clarifying.

As Dusty has pointed out you have a system that been modified, and it really needs some one who can probe the various contacts to see whats if anything is controlling the the external pump. It should be the upper float should turn off the external pump, and the lower float should prevent the internal pump from running if the water level gets too low, but without testing it's impossible to know whether its been correctly wired or not.

As I mentioned previously, as it was repaired by the Techie, they should have tested it and left it functioning correctly. They need to return to sort it out, and it should be free of charge as they were the last ones to touch the system

Hi. I am still looking for help.

The problems have still not been resolved. I have had an approved caravan fitter out to look at the issues. They have checked the electrical and water system and cannot determine why the system is not working correctly.

I can send more pictures and attempt to provide a system diagram.

Can anyone recommend a contact who may be able to take a look or talk me through the issues?

Thank you.

 

[Buckman]

Hi. I am still looking for help.

The problems have still not been resolved. I have had an approved caravan fitter out to look at the issues. They have checked the electrical and water system and cannot determine why the system is not working correctly.

I can send more pictures and attempt to provide a system diagram.

Can anyone recommend a contact who may be able to take a look or talk me through the issues?

Thank you.

If the experience Approved Workshop Scheme fitter cannot resolve the issue then it is highly unlikely any of us can help from a distance. As suggested maybe time to go back to Glossop and ask them to resolve the issue as they installed the system many years ago.

 

[JanJan]

Hi Buckman

Glossop Caravan have not responded to phone calls, leaving messages or completing a form on their website (as directed by their online chat). I am reluctant to drive 200 miles as it appears they have no interest. Also, having looked online at comments and feedback from customers I don’t feel confident they will help.

So any suggestions to how to solve the issues would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you.

 

[Dustydog]

Thanks for the update Jan
If you have the time and knowledge a few of us will be willing to study and comment on a detailed clear schematic diagram. I have a bespoke oem system but not quite as odd as yours. photos of the wires switch gear etc will also help. No promises. My concern is as Buckman says a qualified AWS can’t fix it??. Anyway over to you , I’m still happy to think it out.
BTW where are you geographically?

 

[Buckman]

Hi Buckman

Glossop Caravan have not responded to phone calls, leaving messages or completing a form on their website (as directed by their online chat). I am reluctant to drive 200 miles as it appears they have no interest. Also, having looked online at comments and feedback from customers I don’t feel confident they will help.

So any suggestions to how to solve the issues would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you.

Sounds about right for that dealer according to reviews by other people. Maybe you need physically to speak to someone at Glossop however I am very surprsied that the caravan technician was unable to resolve the issue. Was the technician an Approved Workshop Scheme technician or just another caravan technician?

 

[JanJan]

Thanks for the update Jan
If you have the time and knowledge a few of us will be willing to study and comment on a detailed clear schematic diagram. I have a bespoke oem system but not quite as odd as yours. photos of the wires switch gear etc will also help. No promises. My concern is as Buckman says a qualified AWS can’t fix it??. Anyway over to you , I’m still happy to think it out.
BTW where are you geographically

 

[JanJan]

Hi Dustydog and friends.

Thank you for offering to look at the issues. We are South Bedfordshire. So more like 400 miles round trip to Glossop Caravans.

I will start taking pictures of as much as I can. Then make an attempt to dra

 

[JanJan]

Draw the system.

(Sorry posted reply above without completing)

Thanks again.

 

[Buckman]

Have a look here for an AWS technician. See https://www.approvedworkshops.co.uk/find-approved-workshop

 

[JanJan]

Hi. Here we go.

Photo 1
We plug our Whale Watermaster EP1612 into the socket. The water fills the inside tank.

Photo 2 & 3
The socket does not have a pressure adjust (that would be to the left where it is a white hole) nor a one way valve. These photos show the inline one way valve used.

We have:
Removed the socket and replaced to O rings
Replaced the one way valve.

This part of the system appears to be OK

 

[JanJan]

Have a look here for an AWS technician. See https://www.approvedworkshops.co.uk/find-approved-workshop

Hi Buckman

Our technician is AWS. He was here yesterday.

Thanks

 

[JanJan]

Here are a few more. I took a video but it won’t send.

 

[JanJan]

Solenoid label for reference.