No new diesel cars after 2030

[Jcloughie]

Air con, whether as part of climate control or not, does not only cool the air. It dries it. Hence the condensation seen below the vehicle when you stop, this is why air con will operate whatever the temperature in order to demist. It is also why the air con is on when heating is required. Air, fresh or recycled, is filtered then chilled and dried prior to being passed through the heater. Some commercial systems also have a washer fitted before the air con. But never heard of that in a car. As said already, humidity sensors are fitted. It’s used to be sold as a safety feature, as it can help to keep the driver alert.

I just leave mine switched to auto with air con on. CC will operate with the air con switched off, but with reduced functionality.

I did have one car in which the air con evaporator would freeze solid. But this was due to high humidity not cold temperatures.

John

 

[Beachball]

There a new Kia EV6 electric compact crossover SUV it says can tow up to 1600KG cannot wait to give it a test drive

 

[otherclive]

With Climate Control fitted to most cars, the aircon runs all the time the ambient is above 4 degrees C - below that temperature the aircon is inactive as it would otherwise freeze internally.

Neither of ours have it running all the time yet both have ACC. The Subaru goes through a low emmision warm up cycle and until a blue dash light goes out it doesn’t direct heat into the car and aircon is suppressed. If I get out of the car with aircon switched off it’s stays off until I hit the ACC auto button.

 

[Dustydog]

good explanation John. So it is about removing moisture at the same time

 

[otherclive]

There a new Kia EV6 electric compact crossover SUV it says can tow up to 1600KG cannot wait to give it a test drive

It’s the first Kia since the Stinger to get my pulse racing. Wouldn’t care if it couldn’t tow a rice pudding either. It has the “ look back” factor after parking it.

 

[Beachball]

It’s the first Kia since the Stinger to get my pulse racing. Wouldn’t care if it couldn’t tow a rice pudding either. It has the “ look back” factor after parking it.

Hi otherclive I thought that when i saw it look great

 

[RogerL]

good explanation John. So it is about removing moisture at the same time

That's why car aircon is designed to be used all year round, not just in summer.

 

[Jcloughie]

Neither of ours have it running all the time yet both have ACC. The Subaru goes through a low emmision warm up cycle and until a blue dash light goes out it doesn’t direct heat into the car and aircon is suppressed. If I get out of the car with aircon switched off it’s stays off until I hit the ACC auto button.

Lots of cars default to A/C on, which is fine by me, but upsets some. Perhaps more modern cars will default to off to try to reduce emissions (on paper at least). My guess is is costs about 1 mpg.

John

 

[otherclive]

Lots of cars default to A/C on, which is fine by me, but upsets some. Perhaps more modern cars will default to off to try to reduce emissions (on paper at least). My guess is is costs about 1 mpg.

John

That’s around 3% for mine👎

 

[ProfJohnL]

Lots of cars default to A/C on, which is fine by me, but upsets some. .... My guess is is costs about 1 mpg.

John

That will depend on each car. AC has become more common even on smaller engined entry level cars over the last two decades. Whilst we may see claims for some to be able to do 60mpg, turn on the AC it can drop by considerably more than 1mpg

 

[Jcloughie]

That will depend on each car. AC has become more common even on smaller engined entry level cars over the last two decades. Whilst we may see claims for some to be able to do 60mpg, turn on the AC it can drop by considerably more than 1mpg

Just going by my own experience and the dozen or so cars I have had which have only had marginal impact on mpg. I did say “my guess”. And will accept that smaller engined cars might be more impacted.

Which bring me back to the point I was making re A/C coming on by default.

I have not ever had one, but know of people who have a marked lack of power as soon as the press the A/C button. Perhaps manufacturers put A/C on some unsuitably powered vehicles in order to get sales.

John

 

[otherclive]

That will depend on each car. AC has become more common even on smaller engined entry level cars over the last two decades. Whilst we may see claims for some to be able to do 60mpg, turn on the AC it can drop by considerably more than 1mpg

I once picked up a hire car in Washington DC, it was an automatic Chrysler K car. A small one by American standards. It seemed to have intermittent hesitation so I drove back to the hire center. “Nothing to worry about Sir, it is the air conditioning compressor cutting in”

 

[ProfJohnL]

I remember 4.0L Jeep where when the AC switched on the additional load on the engine was quite noticeable.

 

[otherclive]

I remember 4.0L Jeep where when the AC switched on the additional load on the engine was quite noticeable.

I had 4.2 litre straight 6 CJ Renegade when I lived in Ottawa. Cannot recall whether it had air-conditioning but with a soft top it would not have been much use, and the winter temperatures were so low that the moisture content of the air was minimal. Early January with lots more snow to come.

 

[Buckman]

Our 1996 Corolla 1300 auto has aircon and it is hardly noticeable when it kicks in and out. On a 2006 Corolla 1300 it was very noticeable as the car used to lurch forward. On a hire 2018 Corolla 1600 auto did not notice. On our 30L CRD Jeep you would not know the CC/aircon is kicking in and out.

 

[JezzerB]

Plus one here for the kia. Wow!

 

[Jcloughie]

I imagine that compressors are more efficient that they used to be and probably have soft start clutches to reduce the obvious thud when they engaged. I always have the radio on but I don’t notice it coming on and off. I can remember one car, I think it was a C5, that, if on tick over, the revs would rise slightly just before the A\C cut in.

John

 

[Beachball]

Plus one here for the kia. Wow!

Hi JezzerB What a car could pull a lightweight caravan with that

 

[Raywood]

The manufacturers will admit that the aircon uses power and will increase fuel consumption, some journalists and others have suggested as much as 10%. That seems high, but anything that uses power results in increased fuel use to some extent, although it may be so small you may not notice it.

 

[ProfJohnL]

The manufacturers will admit that the aircon uses power and will increase fuel consumption, some journalists and others have suggested as much as 10%. That seems high, but anything that uses power results in increased fuel use to some extent, although it may be so small you may not notice it.

I tend to agree that claiming fuel consumption would suffer by as much as 10% seems rather high, becasue it would only apply when the compressor is running , and generally once the cabin environment has reached to desired conditions, the compressor will normally cycle on and off at intervals just enough to maintain the conditions.

 

[ProfJohnL]

The discussion in this thread has touched on Domestic Air Sourced Heating.

If you are interested I have started a new thread in Chit Chat

"Domestic Air-Sourced Heating"

 

[ProfJohnL]

Returning to one of the earlier comments about replacing batteries in EV's. One of the first EV's widely available in 2010 was the Nissan Leaf. Probably due to teh technology available at the time the first model Leaf has had a poor record regards battery longevity.

Here is a Youtube posting that may be of interest

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C4nS_tSQiVQ

 

[Buckman]

I tend to agree that claiming fuel consumption would suffer by as much as 10% seems rather high, becasue it would only apply when the compressor is running , and generally once the cabin environment has reached to desired conditions, the compressor will normally cycle on and off at intervals just enough to maintain the conditions.

Wouldn't a lot depend on the size of the engine. In a 1600cc Datsun and also a Corolla 1600 with aircon fuel consumption seemed to be higher than the bigger car with a 2l engine. All petrol.
Although we now have a 1300cc with aircon and a SUV with a 3.0l CRD it is difficult to compare. Both auto. I do know that with the 1300cc mileage increases by about 10% if the air con is turned off.

 

[RogerL]

Wouldn't a lot depend on the size of the engine. In a 1600cc Datsun and also a Corolla 1600 with aircon fuel consumption seemed to be higher than the bigger car with a 2l engine. All petrol.
Although we now have a 1300cc with aircon and a SUV with a 3.0l CRD it is difficult to compare. Both auto. I do know that with the 1300cc mileage increases by about 10% if the air con is turned off.

Both my cars have aircon, one is 800 kg, 69 bhp the other is 2300 kg, 262 bhp - so I'd imagine a huge difference in % terms between aircon on-off

 

[ProfJohnL]

Wouldn't a lot depend on the size of the engine. In a 1600cc Datsun and also a Corolla 1600 with aircon fuel consumption seemed to be higher than the bigger car with a 2l engine. All petrol.
Although we now have a 1300cc with aircon and a SUV with a 3.0l CRD it is difficult to compare. Both auto. I do know that with the 1300cc mileage increases by about 10% if the air con is turned off.

Its not the size of the engine, but the power it can produce.

I have seen varying reports of how much power AC needs, Some as low as 3kW and some as high as 10kW (12.5Hp). Let me be clear I'm only referring to the power input not its COP.

This amount of power will only be drawn when the A/C compressor is running, which as I pointed out above is not usually all the time

For example:- if you had a car with a 75kW engine (approx. 100bhp) with an AC of 7.5kW draw, you would only experience the drop in performance and reduction in fuel economy whilst the AC compressor is working. If the AC only operated for 50% of the time the average loss for performance will only be 3.75kW - If that caused a reduction in fuel economy of 10% for the whole journey there is some other variable not being taken into account.